mtoc Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 Just grabbed a pair of 207, almost new, cost $400... Gonna wanna diy an amp for it, better under $3,000... is kgss seriously overkill? Just wanna have a taste at the famous stax, no interested in the superior models, yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeP Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 jh13? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laowei Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 DIY T2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin gilmore Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 in decreasing order of money (at least I think so, not so sure) all DHT direct coupled thing (no name yet) and a bit pricy (8 x emission labs output tubes) kgsshv carbon circlotron with emission labs tubes diy T2 with emission labs output tubes megatron with emission labs tubes kgbh with emission labs tubes diy T2 with 6ca7 output tubes kgsshv carbon circlotron solid state kgbh with 6ca7 tubes kgsshv carbon the rest do not matter (kgss,kgsshv,all triode,srx2) did I forget any? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laowei Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 KGST. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwl168 Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 If you have to buy all parts from scratch, I don't think a KGSS will be any cheaper than say a KGSSHV Carbon to build. And I do believe you can build a Carbon for under $3000 not counting labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwl168 Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 16 hours ago, kevin gilmore said: in decreasing order of money (at least I think so, not so sure) all DHT direct coupled thing (no name yet) and a bit pricy (8 x emission labs output tubes) kgsshv carbon circlotron with emission labs tubes diy T2 with emission labs output tubes megatron with emission labs tubes kgbh with emission labs tubes diy T2 with 6ca7 output tubes kgsshv carbon circlotron solid state kgbh with 6ca7 tubes kgsshv carbon the rest do not matter (kgss,kgsshv,all triode,srx2) did I forget any? Grounded Grid - probably falls somewhere between KGBH with 6CA7 tubes and KGSSHV carbon in the list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gepardcv Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 12 hours ago, mwl168 said: If you have to buy all parts from scratch, I don't think a KGSS will be any cheaper than say a KGSSHV Carbon to build. And I do believe you can build a Carbon for under $3000 not counting labor. Under $2000, provided you (1) already have all the tools you need, (2) use an inexpensive volume control, and (3) keep your casework modest. (I did none of the above.) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnwmclean Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 2 hours ago, gepardcv said: (I did none of the above.) My method as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiguy Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 2 hours ago, gepardcv said: provided you (1) already have all the tools you need Especially this. I've lost track of how much I've spent on tools for this hobby but I know it's not small. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimL Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 Probably can build an SRX Plus for under $1000, although I've had some problems with the PS recently - the full KGSSHV PS is an excellent substitute. But I'm biased, and as Kevin says, it's not worthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin gilmore Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 I never said it was not worthy. Besides at $1k, its at the lower end price wise and besides, its tubz never liked trying to make 2 power supplies out of one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwl168 Posted October 29, 2016 Report Share Posted October 29, 2016 (edited) I power my SRX Plus with my old KGSSHV PS tuned for 340VDC rails. It works great and I like the combo a lot! My SRX Plus costed me more than $1K to build but I used some fancy tubes and pricy coupling caps Edited October 29, 2016 by mwl168 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimL Posted October 29, 2016 Report Share Posted October 29, 2016 (edited) 16 hours ago, kevin gilmore said: I never said it was not worthy. Joking (subtle reference to Wayne's World). On a serious note, I tried rebuilding my PS to make it quieter and discovered it is significantly noisier than I had thought. OTOH, a friend built a KGST using the KGSSHV PS and it is definitely quieter. Edited October 29, 2016 by JimL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtoc Posted October 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2016 On Friday, October 28, 2016 at 4:39 AM, kevin gilmore said: in decreasing order of money (at least I think so, not so sure) all DHT direct coupled thing (no name yet) and a bit pricy (8 x emission labs output tubes) kgsshv carbon circlotron with emission labs tubes… Which of them has lowest distortion when we implement it properly? Does solid state stuff has lower distortion than the tubey in this case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin gilmore Posted October 30, 2016 Report Share Posted October 30, 2016 It should be clear by now that the cavalli audio liquid lightning version 2T has the lowest distortion of any amplifier on the planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sechtdamon Posted October 30, 2016 Report Share Posted October 30, 2016 (edited) 46 minutes ago, kevin gilmore said: It should be clear by now that the cavalli audio liquid lightning version 2T has the lowest distortion of any amplifier on the planet. It'd be nice, IF low distortion defines the quality of the sound. I found These on a site, which name is so obvious that I don't need to give it. And I assume from your post, Dr. Kevin you saw that too: Quote Correct. Something about the BHSE having a lot of orders vs long lead times. The BHSE is a great amp, though I personally preferred the LLmk1 with the 009. The 007 might pair better with the BHSE, but did not compared that combo back to back. While I'm not into stats currently, I would like to make this post a little more relevant to the LL2mk2. According to Cavalli's own website: For the (I think) original SS LLmk2, and according to Cavalli's webpage: 400V Rails / 1600Vpp Bias - Jack #1 580V, Jack #2 580V, 500V or 540V Measurements Measurements on the new amp are basically the same as below. We'll post these as soon as we get the amps back from reviewers. We have asked Avenson Audio to do THD+N measurements on the LL2. Here are the results. Equipment: Prism DScope Series III. Signal path:Balanced input #1 (going through the input switching network). Input: 1kHz at -13.1dbV to generate 100VRMS peak (280Vpp) output voltage (the way Stax reports on their amps). Load:100pf plus approximately 20pf || 200k from equipment (120pf total). See table in lower left for math (measurements are RMS). I know some may find the THD numbers hard to believe at room temperature... But a transparent-fi dynamic O2 amp seems to pull 0.0016% THD into 150 ohms at room temperature, so while not certain, I don't think those numbers would require to put the amp in the freezer. The -140 dBr noise floor seems reasonable to me as well. Dunno what the numbers are for the latest LLmk2 iteration. Would also like to hear more details on the photo resistor volume control and how it improves performance. Well, he describes O2 as "transparent-fi"... along many other things he knows... Impressive. I'm not sarcastic for this question, I'm asking this cuz I don't know really: Isn't 280ppV little bit low for a measurement of an amp which allegedly can go as high as 1600ppV? And numbers again... i guess THD measurements replaced 80's RMS... And I guess i have a pretty bad DAC, noone knows it's THD... MHDT Lab gives so little tech info about their products... But I must have shitty ears cuz i love my Atlantis. For I cannot hear that low THD numbers, I must have pretty bad ears, so I don't want to hear anything below %0,1 THD for i cannot hear anyway. It's bullshitness is so obvious, why people can not see it I don't understand. 7 hours ago, mtoc said: Which of them has lowest distortion when we implement it properly? Does solid state stuff has lower distortion than the tubey in this case? Don't care about THD, it means no effing thing below one zero IMHO. As I know you have Sr-207. Can you hear the distortions at 20Hz, 200Hz and 2kHz? Edited October 30, 2016 by Sechtdamon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wink Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 7 hours ago, kevin gilmore said: It should be clear by now that the cavalli audio liquid lightning version 2T has the lowest distortion of any amplifier on the planet. i'm waiting for Cavalli to claim that the LL2 and subsequent electrostatic amps actually go into negative distortion. And everybody knows that negative distortion equals commensurate musicality - The moar the bettah...... The big question here is:- How do you measure a pig in a poke..? Length, width, rotundicity, mass or shade of lipstick...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefQon Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 12 minutes ago, wink said: shade of lipstick...? Definitely this along with a high price tag and good bs marketing you got yourself the O2 amp of the electrostatic headphone world. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin gilmore Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 O2 has gain of 10db max electrostatic amps have gain in the range 54 to 60 db pick absolutely the most noise free input fet or bipolar you want, and you can't get to those noise numbers at 54db of gain even pumped liquid helium devices used in nmr cryoprobes (costing about $500k these days) have more noise than this. I have 2 of these and a lot of experience with the parts inside. the dscope as well as audio precision and every other digital computerized thd meter have maximum voltage input limits. So the question is whether they used an input attenuator to generate that, and in any case what the input impedance the amplifier really sees. Because even at 100k input impedance, the meter has a much lower impedance than the headphones would have at 1khz. Measuring this accurately is very hard. Generating bullshit numbers is easy. Every one of the ss amps i have built has a thd of less than .01% with an appropriate 10x attenuator running 95% voltage swing 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spritzer Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Don't go dragging actual physics into this. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wink Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 This ^, It definitely takes away the moist brown factor - and there goes 95% of marketing strategy.... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefQon Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 I wonder when Cavalli will name his next amp Liquid Ass or Liquid Shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sechtdamon Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 38 minutes ago, DefQon said: I wonder when Cavalli will name his next amp Liquid Ass or Liquid Shit. With their huge false ego, i bet they love their farts and shits too. So not far away i guess... I felt before my curiosity once again and i asked to my friends to find me Diarrhea, aka. Liquid Carbon. I'll get it soon and listen it for 1-2 weeks min. And no i'm not a masochist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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