ldj325 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Does anyone have experience with effectively demagnetizing vinyl and how? I have Nitty Gritty record cleaning machine and this helps some. I use a carbon brush on each side of play. I also have a Zerostat (slow squeeze in near the record and then discharge away fro the rrecord) but I hear little effect with this. I know there are a several of machines, one in the $300-400 price range, which I'd consider if it was truly effective. I am looking to cut down on the crackling and/or static type of noise. Am I correct in attributing this noise to static charge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFF Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Does anyone have experience with effectively demagnetizing vinyl and how? I have Nitty Gritty record cleaning machine and this helps some. I use a carbon brush on each side of play. I also have a Zerostat (slow squeeze in near the record and then discharge away fro the rrecord) but I hear little effect with this. I know there are a several of machines, one in the $300-400 price range, which I'd consider if it was truly effective. I am looking to cut down on the crackling and/or static type of noise. Am I correct in attributing this noise to static charge? The Zerostat should be just fine for removing a static charge from the vinyl. The best way to cut down on snap, crackle and pops is to do the following: 0) Remove any bowl of rice crispies that may be nearby. Eating them away from all your equipment is highly recommended. 1) Make sure the vinyl you are playing is in as good condition as possible. A Grade of Mint or Near mint condition is preferable. 2) Clean your records well. I use a VPI 16.5 machine. If using a machine, use good fluid. Coat the record in a layer of cleaning fluid and let it sit on the record for at least 30 seconds. This will allow the fluid to penetrate the grooves and lift out the grunge so it can be sucked out. When you vacuum it, do no more than 3 revolutions as any more will build a static charge. Before I had a machine I would use cotton balls with pure alcohol. Assuming you have no groove wear, most noise comes from small particles lodged within the grooves of the record. Remove these particles and most of the noise will go away. 3) Make sure your needle is clean and properly set up for use with your tonearm. There are many products available for cleaning and maintaining a clean needle as well as setting up a turntable. Google is your friend. 4) Make sure your turntable is level. 5) Make sure all your cables are clean and plugged in correctly. Sometimes a slight movement in a cable will cause a click or pop. That sums it up as far as I know. Feel free to ask questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
909 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 i had static charging issues with my TT until i got the Funk Firm - Achromat 5mm, which has substantially reduced those static pops and crackles by more than 95%. it's now a non-issue and my only static tweak and they also offer a 3mm one, but since you have a Rega TT, you might consider their platter. though, i've not used the platter and don't know if it also curbs static. the mat is not even sold as a static tweak that's just one benefit besides the sonic improvements. i haven't found these discounted anywhere, but make sure you have a right of return. i have demagnetized CDs and the effects were short lived -- first play into the first track they started to fade and after a few tracks they were practically gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFF Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 i had static charging issues with my TT until i got the Funk Firm - Achromat 5mm, which has substantially reduced those static pops and crackles by more than 95%. it's now a non-issue and my only static tweak and they also offer a 3mm one, but since you have a Rega TT, you might consider their platter. though, i've not used the platter and don't know if it also curbs static. the mat is not even sold as a static tweak that's just one benefit besides the sonic improvements. i haven't found these discounted anywhere, but make sure you have a right of return. i have demagnetized CDs and the effects were short lived -- first play into the first track they started to fade and after a few tracks they were practically gone. Damn. I knew I forgot something! No sleep = faulty memory. As for mats - buy some shelf liner at your local supply store. Put a record over it. Trace around the record and cut the shelf liner to size. Great mat, anti-static and better bass response. Total cost should be less than $5.00. Use this stuff: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzziguy Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 how does a vinyl record become magnetic, and what effect would this magnetification have? i can understand static, but magnetism? is it supposed to affect the cartridge? do many records have an issue with significant amounts of ferrous material contaminating the vinyl? They can't. I just assume that the OP meant static issues. Certainly all the responses were addressing static issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Zerostat instructions: How to use? Hold the Zerostat 3 within 12" (30.5 cm) of the surface or object to be treated. Squeeze the trigger slowly for about two seconds, to emit a stream of positive ionized air over the surface of the object. As the trigger is slowly released, a negative flow of air ions is produced resulting in static neutralization. Repeat this procedure at several points across the surface of the object. Each Zerostat 3 unit has a "two cycle" type of operation, when the trigger is squeezed, positive ions are generated and when the trigger is released, negative ions flow. This means that it is possible to induce a charge on a neutral surface using the Zerostat 3. If the trigger is squeezed, and the Zerostat 3 is then removed from the surface (and before allowing the trigger to return to its original position), a positive charge will be induced. Similarly, pointing the Zerostat at the surface only for the release of the trigger will induce a negative charge. You could also buy one of these, which the magazines claim really works: Apparently, there are magnetic issues on vinyl, according to Furutech that makes this demagnetizer: The new Furutech DeMag is a brand-new tool for demagnetizing LPs, CDs, DVDs, SACDs, CD-Rs and DVD-Audio discs. It can also remove built-up magnetism in interconnects, speaker cables and power cords. We know what you’re thinking: Records are made of vinyl! How can you demagnetize an LP? Furutech tells us the carbon used to color vinyl attracts a magneticcharge and this charge affects the magnetic fields in your cartridgecreating distortion. After you demagnetize your records on the DeMag, you will not believe the difference! “Forwhatever reason, demagnetizing an LP definitely removed highfrequency glare and seemed to enrich the midband… It did. Everytime… Period. The difference was obvious… And do not try one of these devices unless you’re prepared to buy it!” - Michael Fremer, Stereophile, October 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDM Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Excellent tip about the self liner. I was just thinking the other day if this would work as a record mat. I've just finished cuttiing one and I'm using it now. IMO this is better than using Rega's oem mat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
909 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 this thing is expensive, even used. i demoed this demager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahame Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 So will running the LHC make things sound better?, or worse? or does it need some burn-in first? How much would they charge to demagnetize an LP. After you demagnetize your records on the DeMag, you will not believe the difference! That's correct. I don't believe there is a before and after difference. At least with the LHC they tested their cables Interaction between current imbalance and magnetization in LHCcables "Summary:The quality of the magnetic field in superconducting accelerator magnets is associated with the properties of the superconducting cable. Current imbalances due to coupling currents ΔI, as large as 100 A, are induced by spatial variations of the field sweep rate and contact resistances. During injection at a constant field all magnetic field components show a decay behavior. The decay is caused by a diffusion of coupling currents into the whole magnet. This results in a redistribution of the transport current among the strands and causes a demagnetization of the superconducting cable. As soon as the field is ramped up again after the end of injection, the magnetization rapidly recovers from the decay and follows the course of the original hysteresis curve. In order to clarify the interactions between the changes in current and magnetization during injection the authors performed a number of experiments. A magnetic field with a spatially periodic pattern was applied to a superconducting wire in order to simulate the coupling behavior in a magnet. This model system was placed into a stand for magnetization measurements and the influence of different powering conditions was analyzed" ... Leading to awesome bass, and highs full of pure win Seriously though, my father used a zerostat anti static gun, together with a viscous anti static mat on his Thorens turntable. The anti static mat was of a gray, plastic/rubber compound similar to ESD anti static mats. The LP's were also kept in anti static liners, as opposed to the default paper sleeves. Seemed to do the trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guzziguy Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Zerostat instructions: How to use? Hold the Zerostat 3 within 12" (30.5 cm) of the surface or object to be treated. Squeeze the trigger slowly for about two seconds, to emit a stream of positive ionized air over the surface of the object. As the trigger is slowly released, a negative flow of air ions is produced resulting in static neutralization. Repeat this procedure at several points across the surface of the object. Each Zerostat 3 unit has a "two cycle" type of operation, when the trigger is squeezed, positive ions are generated and when the trigger is released, negative ions flow. This means that it is possible to induce a charge on a neutral surface using the Zerostat 3. If the trigger is squeezed, and the Zerostat 3 is then removed from the surface (and before allowing the trigger to return to its original position), a positive charge will be induced. Similarly, pointing the Zerostat at the surface only for the release of the trigger will induce a negative charge. You could also buy one of these, which the magazines claim really works: Apparently, there are magnetic issues on vinyl, according to Furutech that makes this demagnetizer: The new Furutech DeMag is a brand-new tool for demagnetizing LPs, CDs, DVDs, SACDs, CD-Rs and DVD-Audio discs. It can also remove built-up magnetism in interconnects, speaker cables and power cords. We know what you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Reason #67 not to have a vinyl rig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I only need reason #1 to own one. It sounds much better than CD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grawk Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I can't hear the difference between a cd I rip from lp and that lp... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I only need reason #1 to own one. It sounds much better than CD Congrats. I fully respect the vinyl crowd for their dedication to a medium that to me only seems to get in the way of actually listening to the music. I get plenty of enjoyment out of CD's that I can rip losslessly and spend 1/100 of the setup time that you vinyl guys do only to have to justify what is generally a higher noise floor in the name of superior sound. So, after only an hour or so of prep you get to sit and listen for 20 minutes before you have to get up, flip the disc, maybe wonder if you remembered to clean both sides only to bump the arm and wonder if you shouldn't realign it before going back to listen only then remembering that you forgot the demag the album. Love that superior sound! But wait, it's only better if you've dropped about 5 grand on a table, arm, cart, stylus, phono-stage, cleaning supplies, f'ing demagnatizer, record brush, global azimuth arm positioning system, etc., etc, ad nauseam. And that's not to mention that it's a complete crapshoot if you can actually find what you want to listen to on vinyl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humanflyz Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Congrats. I fully respect the vinyl crowd for their dedication to a medium that to me only seems to get in the way of actually listening to the music. I get plenty of enjoyment out of CD's that I can rip losslessly and spend 1/100 of the setup time that you vinyl guys do only to have to justify what is generally a higher noise floor in the name of superior sound. So, after only an hour or so of prep you get to sit and listen for 20 minutes before you have to get up, flip the disc, maybe wonder if you remembered to clean both sides only to bump the arm and wonder if you shouldn't realign it before going back to listen only then remembering that you forgot the demag the album. Love that superior sound! But wait, it's only better if you've dropped about 5 grand on a table, arm, cart, stylus, phono-stage, cleaning supplies, f'ing demagnatizer, record brush, global azimuth arm positioning system, etc., etc, ad nauseam. And that's not to mention that it's a complete crapshoot if you can actually find what you want to listen to on vinyl. So does that mean you are selling your vinyl setup Nate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 So does that mean you are selling your vinyl setup Nate? What do you mean, it's already gone. I mean I guess it isn't all gone since I kept the table, but only because shipping it seems impractical and like an invitation for failure. But if someone in the North East wanted a good deal on a Thorens TD-160 I'd certainly sell that too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grawk Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 I've gone for a low end vinyl rig, and with that, I find that I appreciate what it brings to the table, so to speak. It's not convenient, and doesn't fit well in my life, but it does have a certain charm that makes it worthwhile some times. I did decided to not go with a higher end phono stage, because I don't listen for ultimate sound quality, but for the "analog magic", whatever that may be. I don't find myself wishing it sounded 2% better, I just listen and enjoy. Almost exclusively on speakers, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) Congrats. I fully respect the vinyl crowd for their dedication to a medium that to me only seems to get in the way of actually listening to the music. I get plenty of enjoyment out of CD's that I can rip losslessly and spend 1/100 of the setup time that you vinyl guys do only to have to justify what is generally a higher noise floor in the name of superior sound. So, after only an hour or so of prep you get to sit and listen for 20 minutes before you have to get up, flip the disc, maybe wonder if you remembered to clean both sides only to bump the arm and wonder if you shouldn't realign it before going back to listen only then remembering that you forgot the demag the album. Love that superior sound! But wait, it's only better if you've dropped about 5 grand on a table, arm, cart, stylus, phono-stage, cleaning supplies, f'ing demagnatizer, record brush, global azimuth arm positioning system, etc., etc, ad nauseam. And that's not to mention that it's a complete crapshoot if you can actually find what you want to listen to on vinyl. Weird I don't do any of that, and neither does anyone else I know in real life. The noise floor is a non-issue on clean, non-abused vinyl. It's only an inconvenience if you treat music as something to listen to in the background. And not something that is to be actively appreciated. I didn't spend five grand on my setup. Edited September 23, 2008 by deepak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) Weird I don't do any of that, and neither does anyone else I know in real life. The noise floor is a non-issue on clean, non-abused vinyl. It's only an inconvenience if you treat music as something to listen to in the background. And not something that is to be actively appreciated. I didn't spend five grand on my setup. You still ignored the getting up to change sides and the lack of selection. Edited September 23, 2008 by deepak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Weird I don't do any of that, and neither does anyone else I know in real life. The noise floor is a non-issue on clean, non-abused vinyl. It's only an inconvenience if you treat music as something to listen to in the background. And not something that is to be actively appreciated. I didn't spend five grand on my setup. You still ignored the getting up to change sides and the lack of selection. I didn't think I did It's only an inconvenience if you treat music as something to listen to in the background. And not something that is to be actively appreciated. And there is more music out there on vinyl than there is on CD. Sorry I didn't mean to edit your post, I meant to quote it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n_maher Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 And there is more music out there on vinyl than there is on CD.Try inserting "new" into that sentence and get back to me. Sorry I didn't mean to edit your post, I meant to quote it. Sure you didn't oppressor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Try inserting "new" into that sentence and get back to me. I don't have much problem finding new music I want on vinyl. But I guess more indie labels are releasing limited edition vinyl releases which is fine with me. Too true that I would never completely forgo my digital setup Sure you didn't oppressor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ldj325 Posted September 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Geez, ask a technical question on vinyl, and even then it degrades into an uninvited love it/hate it debate. Now if someone can only tell me how to get rid of the static on this thread (the whole forum would be much too much to ask for) I'd be most appreciative. Several times I have shot my Zerostat at the opening page of Head-Case but it doesn't seem to have any effect. For those who don't appreciate vinyl, please leave me in my ignorance. I've been afflicted by this vinyl madness for far too long and somehow it works for me. Besides it keeps me off the streets (my parole officer is appreciative) having to turn over the record every 20 minues and brush off the new side and apply stylus cleaner, not to mention the time to clean each record before it ever hits my TT. (That's right all you CDP, perfect sound forever guys, leave all the vinyl for me.) But then again I actually listen to the music as a full time activity, rather than have it drone on in the background while I do something else. (I've got a CDP for that. ) For all those who've offered positive input, I appreciate the information. Static is not an issue with most of my vinyl, but there are some older records that just have too much to enjoy them. I was thinking that a demagnetizer would handle the static charge, which is really what I'm after. Does anybody know of an unbiased person who has actually used one. (Voltron, I used to use the Zerostat that way. Then someone suggested releasingthe trigger away from the record. Either way I perceive little change in static charge on highly charged records, as super scientifically documented via the record ever the hair of the arm test. And my Zerostat is very old, so maybe it is no longer working properly.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvdunhill Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 move to Texas. that should help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin gilmore Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 We know what you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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