Hygienist Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I sold a Valab NOS DAC I had in preparation for the $320 Chameleon NOS DAC group buy. I loved the Valab, and it delivered on what I wanted it to (musicality and vocals), and I assumed the Chameleon would only better that. However, I read through the NOS DAC bashing thread with Dan Lavry, and now I'm wondering if my love for the Valab is only because I haven't heard any other half decent DACs. What's yall's opinions on NOS DACs as a whole? Would you advise getting the Chameleon, ever? The only other DAC I've read of that has the traits I desire (warmth, musicality, etc; basically analog sound) is the DAC19MKIII, which is unavailable until later this month and costs about twice as much after I get the filter board (PMD 1000) I need. I asked this same question on Head-Fi, but this forum appears to be a bit more brutally honest with stuff, which is really what I need right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morphsci Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I prefer Horned Lizards myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mypasswordis Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Everything I have is both NOS and milspec. Sounds good, man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvdunhill Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 which is really what I need right now. Sorry, I don't have what you need. Also, your Welcome PM suggests giving before receiving around here, just a warning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duggeh Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 My DAC oversamples, but I've no experience of NOS DACs at the same level. No idea how big a factor it is compared to say, output stages, power supplies or wood trims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currawong Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I turned oversampling off in my DAC, and it lost detail, mushing up the music. It didn't sound unpleasant, just in the end leaving oversampling on was the best option. I recall Dan Lavry making a big post on HF rubbishing NOS DACs. That's all I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pars Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 A lot of those guys in the Valab thread seem to like distortion Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio - View Single Post - Valab NOS DAC - subjective listening and modifications, and confusing analog mods with digital (silver digital cables. ad nauseum). That and many simple NOS DACs roll off the high end, not unlike some of the tube amps that are or were popular supposedly do, such as the Doge and the Bada (IIRC). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I've used a Monica USB for a while. Better a good NOS DAC than a poorly designed oversampling one. But NOS can be bettered. I bought one of the on sale Pico's and it takes off some of those rough edges. And of course 20 other great DACS come up for sale used. FS: TwistedPearAudio OPUS dac modules and power supply. - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio And here's another good one [For Sale] Cambridge DacMagic - Club Polk New with good reviews HIGH RESOLUTION TECHNOLOGIES - MUSICSTREAMER+ - CD/DVD PLAYERS The last year has seen a lot of these come down to near NOS DAC prices. And Quality has improved to pretty good levels. Not high end. But pretty damn good bang for the buck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger945 Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Then you've got Steve Nugent posting on CA, claiming the Valab to be comperable to $10k dacs with a simple output cap swop. "World class" and "no brainer" he calls it...but "not as good as my Overdrive." Oh, did I forget to mention the one little detail. It needs a low jitter source. But don't they all Steve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Chalk Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Better a good NOS DAC than a poorly designed oversampling one. But NOS can be bettered.This. In 30 words or less, even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faust3d Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I really like my custom made and designed NOS DAC with tube output stage. I did, however heard some really bad NOS DACs that sounded all mushy and edgy. Listen to it, if you like it, buy it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hygienist Posted January 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I'm in agreement about a few of the people in the Valab topics; some of them do seem to be a bit unconventional, and I'm pretty damn sure that Bill guy who talks really formally is related to the reseller or developer (reminds me of Beresford posting on his head-fi alt accounts). I've used a Monica USB for a while. Better a good NOS DAC than a poorly designed oversampling one. But NOS can be bettered. I bought one of the on sale Pico's and it takes off some of those rough edges. And of course 20 other great DACS come up for sale used. FS: TwistedPearAudio OPUS dac modules and power supply. - Head-Fi: Covering Headphones, Earphones and Portable Audio And here's another good one [For Sale] Cambridge DacMagic - Club Polk New with good reviews HIGH RESOLUTION TECHNOLOGIES - MUSICSTREAMER+ - CD/DVD PLAYERS The last year has seen a lot of these come down to near NOS DAC prices. And Quality has improved to pretty good levels. Not high end. But pretty damn good bang for the buck. I appreciate your linking used ads within my price range for well reviewed DACs. However, my uncertainty as to whether NOS is really as bad as Lavry said stems from reviews like this The Nearfield: The Devilsound USB DAC And Channel Islands Audio VDC 9.0 Review By Steven Stone that say the Music Streamer+ (very well reviewed, as you stated) is given equal competition by a Devilsound NOS DAC. And from the reviews comments on both DACs, I'd have gone with the Devilsound since the "tube" sound was what I was looking for in the first place. According to what Lavry said, in theory the Music Streamer+, a very recently released DAC that's been given giant killer status from 6moons, should've stomped on a NOS DAC like the Devilsound, but that didn't happen. You know what? Screw it, I'll just order the Chameleon. Way I figure, I can sell it for about the same price I got it from the group buy, if it turns out NOS really is bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MomijiTMO Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Look a lot of Head Fi posts are pretty whacko so don't read too much [if anything] into it. I tried reading that Valab thread a while back and I just didn't get what people were trying to achieve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spritzer Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 No idea how big a factor it is compared to say, output stages, power supplies or wood trims. My NOS dac had wood trim and is filled with BG's and Rikens. Must be moar awesome then any other... It isn't a bad little dac though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrarroyo Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I purchased an used Lite DAC-AH from Gene and modded it by replacing the output op-amps w/ a passive output using oil filled caps. I also added some heat sinks, drilled some vent holes, installed thicker rubber feet, and checked the right voltage. Overall I was very satisfied for the little money I had in it. Heck some days I still regret selling it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elephas Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 I didn't like the few NOS units I've heard. Smooth-sounding and full-bodied, but it can be a bit too much. Also lacking in details and comparatively sluggish-seeming. Hmm, that's kind of like me, actually. I have a smooth head, I'm full-bodied and definitely very sluggish. Aargh, I don't like myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 That's the real problem is many of us only have listened to a few DACs and that makes for poor A vs. B judgements. I can't think of many places to go audition DACS, other than Head Fi meets. The other choice is to blindly drop a wad of cash on one of those big name units. I was frozen in place for about a year mulling over what DAC to upgrade to. The Pico on sale was a no brainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Monkey Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Buy them all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitz Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Buy them all from Dinny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerius Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I didn't like the few NOS units I've heard. Smooth-sounding and full-bodied, but it can be a bit too much. Also lacking in details and comparatively sluggish-seeming. My impressions are about the same, except for the sluggish sounding part. I don't really find them sluggish or slow, but that's just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Monkey Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Like buttah? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvdunhill Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 i've heard a few, and they were always a bit over-smooth, to me. compared to non over smoothing DACs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Chalk Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Compared to real life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grawk Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 ok, just for clarification: this forum's opinion on anything: nothing. the individual members have opinions. if you want group think, fuck off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morphsci Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I changed my mind, I now prefer these to chameleons: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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