mulveling Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Yay - new gear acquisitions to help ease the burdens of life... As to why I bought it... Well I must admit I like to listen fairly loud at night, as I'm all alone for blocks from 12am to 5am. I thought the 35 Watts of the restored Eico HF-87 (cathode biased, quad of EL34) was enough into the 93db/Watt Tannoys, as the sound it yielded was for the most part super-clean. Funny thing I only recently discovered about hard-clipping on these tube amps, though - it sounds a LOT like the light crackling you get from minor flaws on a record. So, when it did clip it was somewhat camouflaged, though I still should of made the connection WAY earlier...yep I still feel pretty stupid for that. It's not very common and it doesn't always happen or not happen when I would have expected, exactly. For example I can run material like Kiss up to what my ears will tolerate and not clip (even at just 35 Watts/ch), whereas 2 segments (in particular) of Gilbert And Sullivan's "The Mikado" will do it starting just a hair above moderate volume levels. Segments with a sustained and rolling, rumbling base of low frequency sounds with a sudden outburst of midrange/treble heavy transient peaks - THAT is what really spurs it. So you could think of these as more typical of movie soundtrack-ish type situations, though it's certainly a problem for certain non-soundtrack albums too. I added a digital player (Sony C79ES - 1990's 5-disc changer) last week, the first time in a year I've had a digital hookup in the main system, and THAT is what exposed the problem in short order. When you hear "record crackle" on a CD, you know you've got another issue!! Fortunately the upper range Tannoys are seriously tough - a 2" round-wire tweeter voice coil is fairly heat-dissipating. They're rated at what is likely an honest 135Watts continuous, 400 peak, and a 35W tube amp can't dump anywhere near that even with a pure square wave. So, no worries about their well-being. So in comes the Atlas... It was clear right from the start that the extra headroom afforded by the Atlas belies its 55Watt rating. This amp can go noticeably louder than the Eico, completely clean, on even the worst stress-test segments from The Mikado. It's definitely more than the < 2db difference indicated by the power ratings. It sounded like well more than 3db of extra headroom, and it is - I later found out Stereophile measured the Atlas at 86Watts/ch, which makes sense as I believe the Eico does hit an honest 35W. There may be even more effective headroom than this in certain situations, if the Atlas does a better job handling certain areas of the impedance curve, which it may well (sure sounds like it). Beyond the power issue, man the Atlas SOUNDS amazing. There's a solid improvement of each of the following areas, and the magnitude of these improvements was more than what I got from upgrading my preamp (which is a matching Rogue 99 Magnum): * Dynamics - dynamic swings are wider and cleaner than ever. The details "in the middle" are more cleanly delineated. Clearly there was some compression with the Eico during high demand passages. Without a more powerful yardstick to measure by, and as good as the Tannoys sound on their own merits, I was in the dark about this. * Vocal presence - The "singer/chorus is in my room" phenomenon is at its highest level, and it's downright CREEPY (and/or ecstasy inducing, depending on the material) at night with the lights off. * Imaging - Yep, stuff is placed even more precisely within a now slightly larger stage. * Bass slam - This should go without saying after the power/clipping discussion. * Response to upstream components. I've been swapping between two phono stages - the Aragon 47k and the Benz PP-1 - and christ, the differences are shockingly significant for them both being set at 100 ohm loading. The Aragon has a lush, warm midrange, a bit at the expense of imaging, treble extension, and resolution. The Benz kills on the latter 3, but doesn't have the same midrange warmth and can be just a *touch* bright with a few records. So, in summary: Mike is dumb and should have bought this damn amp when he got his Kensingtons. Mike has a surplus of boat-anchor style equipment he'd like to sell locally, but the economy isn't especially accommodating right now Bought the Atlas from my favorite local hifi dealer (and Rogue is a built-in-USA company ), which may be considered financially dumb considering the Audiogon option, but it felt good to support the local dealer, especially one who really DOES add real value in expertise and services. Times are tough for him right now I've been away from posting for quite some time, and have been missing it more recently. Life the past several months has been full of ups & downs, trials & tribulations. Pictures: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cetoole Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Sweet. I am kinda in love with the built in holder for the bias pot trimmer, might have to steal that idea sometime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manaox2 Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Sweet. I am kinda in love with the built in holder for the bias pot trimmer, might have to steal that idea sometime. That is a nice option. Are those fuse mounts being used there you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cetoole Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Yes, looks like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penger Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Damn that looks sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulveling Posted November 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 That is a nice option. Are those fuse mounts being used there you think? Almost certainly. They're larger than the bias fuse mounts used in this amp, but otherwise very similar in shape/structure. They might be the same part as either of the power supply fuses, but I'm not gotta open up the guts right now to find out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penger Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Assuming I'm thinking of the same Mike... AudiogoN ForSale: Rogue Audio Atlas It's in Florida... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swt61 Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Damn Mike, you do have one tasty looking system! Love the digs too. Congrats on the new amp, it sure looks the business. What are the two Sony pieces? Looks like maybe a disc changer and a pre-amp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulveling Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Damn Mike, you do have one tasty looking system! Love the digs too. Congrats on the new amp, it sure looks the business. What are the two Sony pieces? Looks like maybe a disc changer and a pre-amp? Thanks Steve! These digs have been amazing since moving in last fall. The convenience of loft living on a town square without any pesky neighboring tenants. Good build quality (circa late 1800's) too That's a Sony C79ES 5-CD changer under the SOTA. It's an early/Mid 90's piece. Been loving the carousel changer action - it's quite nicely done. Features "simulated" wood side panels that look kinda like rosewood, if you squint - I'd much rather they used real wood there, as I'm sure you can understand! The sound is nicely relaxed; warm and endlessly smooth yet with a good punch to it. So I finally broke down and decided to add a digital player. When I walked in to my hifi shop 2 weeks ago I told them I wanted something cheap yet musical, preferably a vintage piece lacking the typical modern digital sizzle. Cutting-edge resolution was not a requirement. After looking/listening to a late 80's Carver and an 80's Harmon Kardon I decided on the Sony. It was a bit more - at $100 consignment it's probably got a premium over the used market prices - but still WELL worth it for the quality and convenience rendered. It's exceeded my modest goals and I've been enjoying some old CDs (not acquired on vinyl), a great deal. I can unreservedly recommend this player for anyone in a similar situation. Yeah...that mess above the deck is my Benz PP-1 phono with a custom 100-ohm loading box. I'd like to tidy that part of the system up, for sure. The Aragon 47k sure LOOKS a lot cleaner sitting on top of the deck. The piece under the tape deck is the matching Sony ES tuner - currently on loan - and unfortunately it's likely going back. I don't get as good FM reception in my loft as I was hoping for - it's a shame since 90.1 plays some nice classical tunes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swt61 Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Features "simulated" wood side panels that look kinda like rosewood, if you squint - I'd much rather they used real wood there, as I'm sure you can understand! Mike, send me one of the side panels as a pattern, and I can whip out a pair of real Rosewood (or any wood of your choosing) panels in minutes. I did the same for a Sony unit I owned back in the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulveling Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Mike, send me one of the side panels as a pattern, and I can whip out a pair of real Rosewood (or any wood of your choosing) panels in minutes. I did the same for a Sony unit I owned back in the day. Woah, cool! Will do, thanks Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morphsci Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Mike, send me one of the side panels as a pattern, and I can whip out a pair of real Rosewood (or any wood of your choosing) panels in minutes. I did the same for a Sony unit I owned back in the day. Just one of the reasons I love this place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_hankins Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Congrats on the new amp Mike. Have you tried the Rogue Stealth phonostage? See you sunday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulveling Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Congrats on the new amp Mike. Have you tried the Rogue Stealth phonostage? See you sunday. Yes I have, though it was a year ago with different speakers, amp, and preamp. It sounded good (odd distortion issues into the Gilmore Reference aside) but I preferred the Benz PP-1 T8 version - and I later got the T9, which itself sounds better than the T8. It would be interesting to give it another go for an all-Rogue system, but I'm just skeptical about it beating the T9, which has been seriously solid and is ridiculously quiet. I absolutely love the Rogue tube gear I've heard, but the Stealth is the odd man out in the lineup, being the only SS piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopstretch Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 That is one sweet system. As a married and kid-ridden spud, I envy you your audio arrangements! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_hankins Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Mike, why the speaker cable change? I thought you were using the audioquest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulveling Posted November 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 Mike, why the speaker cable change? I thought you were using the audioquest? Yep...good eye! I had the AQ cables terminated with small spades on amp end to fit the vintage/McIntosh screw terminals They don't fit onto even the Atlas's very modest binding posts. So, luckily I still had your old LAT cables with nice modern terminations. I have no complaints about the sound, obviously. Cables aside, the new setup is clearly superior. Ideally I'd like to sell the AQ to recoup some funds, but curiosity and all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted November 17, 2009 Report Share Posted November 17, 2009 And a classic reel to reel hiding in the background. Have any luck in finding blank tape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TC_Shadow Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Congrats on the new amp! Beautiful Tannoy! Have you tried running your Tannoy using SS? I have heard Kensington w/o the super tweeter paired with Luxman 509u; and I must say I was completely floored by the transparency and the dynamics (there seem to be endless power behind the spkr during one of the busy passages in Mahler 3). SS bought back the scale of the performance. I am not sure you have a large enough room to really use more power, but at least it's something to keep in mind when you upgrade your listening space Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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