Currawong Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 A new music player: AyreWave from sbooth.org Mentioned here: Stereophile: Wavelength Leads the Way Initial impressions this morning is that it puts out better music than Amarra Mini (2.0.1). More texture to instruments (low-level detail) with my LCD-2 or borrowed O2 rigs. If I don't pay attention, but just listen to a good acoustic track in a relaxed manner in both, then I get the feeling that Amarra is a little bit more hard-edged digital in presentation and with AyreWave the music sounds a bit more "real". The simple UI is good: Select a bunch of tracks in iTunes or the Finder and click on the relevant button in AyreWave to add them to the persistent playlist. Pretty damn good for free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubliss Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Strangely, I was downloading this app as you wrote this post. Listening now and initial impressions are good. It does seem a bit more relaxed, in a good way, than Pure Music, which has been my go to lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 For anyone with an HDCD DAC can you check if these programs are out putting a bit perfect signal with an HDCD encoded CD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Chalk Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I doubt it. If any software manipulates the signal at all, the first thing to go would be bit perfection. I'd use hdcd.exe (or equivalent) to decode the HDCD encoding in software, then use that as your input file. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepak Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Well I thought Amarra was bit perfect. But a Sonic Studios rep won't answer one way or the other Is Amarra bit-perfect? Below is the text of an email from Jon Reichbach of Sonic Studio which was posted on another forum in response to the question "Is Amarra bit-perfect?" "In almost all Digital Audio Processing systems there is some amount of processing. For example, every 24 bit integer PCM sample is most likely converted to a float and then back to a sample in the audio driver/hardware. Other types of processing could include Gain, EQ, and Dither. Amarra does not process the data in anyway unless the user specifies it. There are times though when some processing is important. For example, when using the digital gain in Amarra one would want to apply dither as it will improve the sound. Likewise, if the EQ can help with the bass response then it should be used. The fact is that most modern day Digital Audio system perform some manipulation of the audio, even for simple conversion. Regarding bit perfect, the HDCD light will show that the HDCD sync bit is being read correctly as detailed in the HDCD specification This bit is verified every 10 frames (1/3 of a second of audio). It does not guarantee that all the bits are OK, nor does it guarantee that every bit is correct only that the HDCD sync mark is valid. On the other hand, this is a very good indication that the audio is correct but is not an indication of full data integrity. Only with a valid digital NULL test where both signals are played in synch with one out of phase can a full bit test be done. The most important part of this is how it sounds." enjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salt Peanuts Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I wish I can try it but it keeps hanging when try to add tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salt Peanuts Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Tried again after a reboot. It was going well for a bit but now it's stuck being unresponsive again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currawong Posted October 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 If you open up the Console, do you get any interesting errors relating to the program? As for bit perfect, I wouldn't imagine that turning on dither and a set output word length in the prefs would output bit perfect. I think the whole bit-perfect thing is a hangover from Windows XP discussion where the system screwed up the audio output. For me, I've thought to experiment whether allowing Amarra Mini to increase the word length to 24 bits (with or without dither) made any difference compared to the 840c's up-sampling, or that of the Reference 3. Some playing around only revealed that the volume level changed switching up-sampling on and off in the Cambridge, so without an SPL meter, I'm rather screwed trying to discern a difference. Going by my average knowledge of digital things, I'd probably have to listen at damaging levels to discern a difference anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Chalk Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Well I thought Amarra was bit perfect. But a Sonic Studios rep won't answer one way or the otherThis basically confirms what I am saying, I.E. that the answer is no, it's not bit perfect, unless you have all processing turned off:Is Amarra bit-perfect? Below is the text of an email from Jon Reichbach of Sonic Studio which was posted on another forum in response to the question "Is Amarra bit-perfect?" "In almost all Digital Audio Processing systems there is some amount of processing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salt Peanuts Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 If you open up the Console, do you get any interesting errors relating to the program? I quickly looked through it, but I didn't see any. I think it's somehow related to how much music I try to add in at once. I'll probably give it a shot over the weekend when I'll have more time to troubleshoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currawong Posted October 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I just added 833 tracks in one hit and it survived. How many did you try? Wouldn't surprise me if adding a few thousand tracks killed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salt Peanuts Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 About 10gig worth in ALAC. FWIW, it survived ~6gb just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopstretch Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 (edited) I wonder if Stephen Booth is going to get a phone call from Charles Hansen? The name certainly seems to create potential for confusion given that there's already one quite well-known Ayre in the audio space. Edited October 19, 2010 by Hopstretch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 It's not related to Ayre? Why is it called AyreWave? That is whack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubliss Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Pretty sure they are in this together? Anyway, back to PM for me. Remote function just is essential from ipad/itouch. Besides, after initial impressions, sound seems pretty similar. Amazing how strong placebo is after reading impressions of something. I tend to hear what i read right away, then on closer inspection, the halo of delusion evaporates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Did you try Amarra and move on, Andy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubliss Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I got it free with the Model 4, but i find myself using PM most all all, they sound similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltron Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 Are you diggin' the Model 4? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubliss Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 (edited) It is most awesome! Haven't even reached for the APL in months. It is easier and i have all four of my amps hooked up to a breakout cable, so easy switching for my many moods . I should figure out how to run the APL through the Model 4. That would make things easier. Edited October 19, 2010 by blubliss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironbut Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I've been using the Pure Music player for a while and I like it. I demo'ed Amara 4 and, straight out of the box, I enjoyed the Amara's sound better. After dicking around with the settings on PM for a while, I founds some settings that emulated the stuff I liked with Amara and considering the price difference, I've been sticking with PM. I like the way you can tailor PM to whatever you like and while it was pretty clunky for a while, it's pretty stable now. I'd still prefer to have the option of native flac support but until iTunes supports it, it doesn't matter much. I still listen to analog of one sort or another the majority of my "pleasure" listening time so spending a ton of money on a computer based player for me just doesn't make sense for me. I'm glad to see an open source player with audiophile aspirations hit the scene. I'll download it and give it a whirl (I saw the Stereophile blog and I'm glad this thread reminded me to download it). "Play" isn't too shabby sounding and I listened to it for a few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driftwood Posted October 19, 2010 Report Share Posted October 19, 2010 I wonder if Stephen Booth is going to get a phone call from Charles Hansen? The name certainly seems to create potential for confusion given that there's already one quite well-known Ayre in the audio space. In the about box, it says: Special Thanks to: Charles Hansen J. Gordon Rankin Clarke Greene I'd suspect Ayre knows about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currawong Posted October 20, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2010 Pretty sure they are in this together? Anyway, back to PM for me. Remote function just is essential from ipad/itouch. Besides, after initial impressions, sound seems pretty similar. Amazing how strong placebo is after reading impressions of something. I tend to hear what i read right away, then on closer inspection, the halo of delusion evaporates. I contemplated not posting impressions in my first post for this reason. Probably what I need to do is use it for a while, switch to something else, and see how I feel. Usually it ends up being that I feel the music is better or worse with one or the other this way. I did that with digital cables, though in the end it was BNC vs. RCA, and the former, being closer to spec, won easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blubliss Posted October 20, 2010 Report Share Posted October 20, 2010 Wasn't referring to your impressions actually. Read impressions at Computer Audiophile. I barely go to that place because most of the stuff there is utter BS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currawong Posted October 20, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2010 No worries. I don't read Computer Audiophile often. I'm going to try Pure Music again though, as Amarra Mini has a problem with not starting to play until 4-10 seconds into the song if it has been left idle for even a minute. It's a mystery, even to Sonic Studios. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironbut Posted October 20, 2010 Report Share Posted October 20, 2010 Read impressions at Computer Audiophile. I barely go to that place because most of the stuff there is utter BS. I'm sorry to say that I agree with you 100% Andy. Unfortunately, when it comes to computer audio, the only places I've found with good info have been the Pro Audio forums and there's quite a learning curve to understand what the hell they're talking about there many times. The last couple of upgrades of PM have been bug free (afaik). I use memory play in hog mode with no dithering and most of the other stuff shut off for most music. For classical (I have lots of 24/48 files) I also use upsampling with the highest fidelity option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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