I prefer Shakespeare myself, "And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." An open mind is a great companion for healthy scepticism, and vice-versa.

well played, Dan.

This is like a couple of muslims debating whether or not judaism is the one true religion.

I prefer Shakespeare myself, "And therefore as a stranger give it welcome. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." An open mind is a great companion for healthy scepticism, and vice-versa.

Exactly.....

I found they both suck donkey balls because they only work on those faggy macs.

I'll wait for the amarra ipod version

Really, I was just trying to find out what the software did (or was supposed to do). I asked Dreadhead for clarification on his comment since in another thread it seemed to be suggested that some sort of DSP is done, which interested me

I did try it on the model 4 a couple times. However, I didn't seem to really know how to use it very well. When I tried to compare on vs. off, the levels didn't match. I tried to compensate for that, but only by ear. So, while it seemed like after I did that I was getting the same sort of sound, I couldn't really conclude much. It would be neat to run a good comparison test some time . I didn't ask questions about it for the purpose of trying to debunk it; I was just genuinely curious about what it did.

i liked Al's Amarra system when I heard it, but if the output is a bit perfect to the input then, well, what precisely does the software do? i'd like to see a double blind test, but i'm not going to spend the money to do it, because i don't really care.

You could do it with the demo.

I've been playing with Pure Music this weekend and so far I'm not crazy about it from a pure usability perspective. My anecdotal impression is that Amarra also sounds better.

Both conclusions echo exactly what JP thought when he tried out Pure Vinyl as a playback option awhile ago.

That's what I concluded too. Amarra seems to make the music more lively and intense. As for what it's doing, I recall the instructions on the first version I tried months ago insisting I set up Audio Midi Setup in some way regarding the input. This suggests to me that what it's doing is using the clock on the audio input instead of on the audio output (that is, if there are two clocks, which I don't know without either pulling my machine out and/or hunting for logic board pictures) and this somehow improves things, along with loading and pre-processing audio files in advance into memory.

I just had a look inside Amarra Mini after having a look at the files Amarra had open, and found a bunch of iZotope plug-ins inside: iZBase, iZDSPBase, iZotope_MBITPlus, iZotope_Resampler. The plot thickens!

Actually, on second thoughts after a bit of googling, all those iZotope plug-ins must be for the re-sampling option and not for playback.

Barry Diament seems to be a fan of the Pure Music plugin though I don't know if he has tried Amarra.

FYI, Gordon Rankin of Wavelength Audio seems to be a proponent of PM - you can google Computer Audiophile and there are exchanges between Barry and Gordon on one of the forums.

I've downloaded demo myself to try - not sure what to make of it for now...

this is digressing from original thread, but speaking of Barry Diament, he also states that the best DAC today is ULN-8, and if he can't have the ULN-8 then the ULN-2. I find that quite an endorsement of ULN-8, but even more so for ULN-2 (need to hunt down a used ULN-2 one for a second firewire based system...)

I own a unl-2 and have a ULN-8 on the way great DAC and ADC as well. Not sure about the best in the world but all things considered extremely good and sonically far above their price point.

Anyone knows if a 2ch alternative (or ULN-2 upgrade to ULN-8 specs) is going to be released? I think it'd be great having a good 2ch AD/DAC with the sonic improvements the ULN-8 seems to have over the ULN-2. I find the ULN-8 "interesting", but I won't buy a 8ch device for 2ch only use.

Anyone knows if a 2ch alternative (or ULN-2 upgrade to ULN-8 specs) is going to be released? I think it'd be great having a good 2ch AD/DAC with the sonic improvements the ULN-8 seems to have over the ULN-2. I find the ULN-8 "interesting", but I won't buy a 8ch device for 2ch only use.

the answer the comes back each tome this is asked is no as they are a pro audio company and want to remained focused on that market.

While I understand your point from a straight line logic perspective if the uln-8 is subjectively better than dacs in it's price point (I thought it was better than the Berkeley Alpha) than why care that it comes with stuff you don't need. Your all set to go down to the local tavern and record your favorite band with this thing all you need is mics.

Can certainly vouch for the ULN-2. Still getting used to it in my system. The set-up has a learning curve, but if you take the time to go over some of the set-up videos it is not that bad. I haven't even tried it in Firewire mode yet, just coaxial SPDIF. As far as the ULN-8 I cannot comment on sonics but it seems to me that if you are running multiple amps (i.e. dynamic, electrostatic and speaker) then you already have 6 of 8 channels spoken for n'est-ce pas ?

...but it seems to me that if you are running multiple amps (i.e. dynamic, electrostatic and speaker) then you already have 6 of 8 channels spoken for...

hey that's me right now, so let's see, if I divide by 3...wow the ULN-8 is actually a bargain (pretty easy to convince/trick myself to buy something new around here!)

I see your points. However my system is already configured to be fed by 2ch sources, so having additional sources for all the amps isn't a real advantage. It'd be just giving some use to gear that would rest unused. Not much of a point paying for 6 channels I don't need. Pros will use them, but not me. Then there's the pro oriented issue. If the current ULN-2 is pro oriented, I don't see why an improved ULN-2 wouldn't be too.

I'm quite happy with the "main" DAC I've been using for the last 7 years or so, not really into "improving" it. Getting the ULN-2 would be more for the AD capabilities than for the own DAC. However if for a sensible price I can get also an interesting DAC, why not. I might sell the DA-11 -or bringing it to this system- and still having a computer compatible DAC that sounds good. Like the DA11, I'd only use it for computer as a source duties, playing HR files, not for the CDs I have at home.

My impression is that uln-2 is meant to be a mobile recording/monitoring device while the uln-8 is a studio/mastering ad/da, different tools for different uses.

sorry for having taken this thread way off track!

fyi, the side comment about Barry Diament's view on ULN-8 and ULN-2, he is careful to state that he is opining on the sound of the DAC, he is not opining on it as studio tool (which he himself states is beyond what audiophiles need/use at home).

PureVinyl or PureMusic sound great to me: big, big improvement over iTunes . . . can't wait for them to sort out the playback bugs!